Office of the Historian

246. Transcript of a Telephone Conversation Between the President’s Assistant for National Security Affairs (Kissinger) and Director of Central Intelligence Helms1

Washington, May 28, 1971, 5:50 p.m.

H: Happy Birthday.2

K: Thank you.

H: That’s what I was calling about …

K: I appreciate it. I had a question: Are you sure the Soviet submarine is nuclear powered?3

H: No, I am not. We had a conversation about that yesterday. It is not clear what that submarine is. TASS has made an announcement to the effect that it’s going to be there.4

K: But if it’s nuclear powered and cruise missile …

H: It’s okay.

K: Well, technically, but I would then let Dobrynin know that they are getting to the limit of the understanding and it’s a hell of a time to annoy us. But if it’s a diesel submarine it’s okay. We haven’t even heard that it might be a Y-Class submarine.

H: It might be some kind of communication link between two things. But it was too inconclusive and couldn’t be proven.

K: Can you find out for me as fast as possible if it is nuclear-powered with cruise-type missiles?

H: I don’t know if I can …

K: It’s supposed to be an #–2 [E–2] type submarine.

H: I’ll check on that.

K: Would you and give me the best judgment of your people?5

  1. Source: National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Henry Kissinger Telephone Conversation Transcripts, Box 10, Chronological File. No classification marking.↩
  2. Kissinger was born on May 27, 1923, in Fürth, Germany.↩
  3. See Document 245.↩
  4. See footnote 2, Document 228.↩
  5. Helms called Kissinger back at 5:55 p.m.: “H: You had more information than I had faster than I did. It is an E–2, nuclear powered, with cruise missiles. There was a photo taken. K: That you are sure about? H: Yes, no question. You’re on good grounds. K: It’s on the margin of the understanding.” (National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Henry Kissinger Telephone Conversation Transcripts, Box 10, Chronological File)↩